Astro Galaxy - a realistic space exploration game

Jupiter
 
Attacker opened fire!

PMI Command #1 Vs. Sargas Oil Jupiter Station

Weapons assault
Sargas Oil Jupiter Station locks on target and attacks first.
Sargas Oil Jupiter Station attacks with Strategic Nuke MK VI => Incoming Nuke!
Radiological detonation on target, doing 168581 damage!
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CC using standard formation.
Light hit on target, doing 82621 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CC using standard formation.
Minor hit on target, doing 60088 damage!


Boarding assault
PMI Command #1 maneuvers into boarding range first.
PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK C to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 140055 damage!
Sargas Oil Jupiter Station sending Marines Assault Unit MK X to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 18579 damage!

PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK C to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 135767 damage!

PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK C to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 125763 damage!
Target shield is down!
OVERLOAD IMMINENT!
Sargas Oil Jupiter Station exploded in a ball of fire!

PMI Command #1 is inspecting the station wreckage...
292 m3 Nickel, 59 m3 Danbaite, 19 m3 Aluminum, 4 m3 Gold, 2475 m3 Taenite, 654 m3 Cabriite, 7856 m3 Mercury, 213 m3 Iron, 54 m3 Lead, 689 m3 Moissanite, 72 m3 Oxygen, 2303 m3 Bromine scooped into cargo bay.
Target cargo bay was empty.
PMI Command #1 captured a group of 881 enemy personnel during the fight.

Objective: Destroy 10% or more of the enemy while losing less % then the enemy. 
 
Attacker victory!
 



I accuse JJL of malfeasement in violating his own ban on attacks in SOL system and demand reperations!

This was done in response to corperate theft.  Mata took modules he had made for the big corp ship and left to join your corp without even discussing the issue with me.  I brought it up with him. Didn't get anywhere.   I tried to talk to you.  But you just blew me off with bullcrap responses and stuff.  I was tired of it.  Theft from corp ships is something I take very seriously and you know that.  So since talking proved pointless I figured what the hell.  So I blew up that station and another one on the outer ring.  You can see how much weaker that former large corp ship was there if you look at the power rating on the reports page.  It wouldn't be down so low if the modules weren't stolen.  Oh and here is the report on the other station I blew up on the 3rd ring.


Theta VKJ 6061
 
Attacker opened fire!

PMI Scout #1 Vs. Sargas Oil #73
Weapons assault
Sargas Oil #73 locks on target and attacks first.
Sargas Oil #73 attacks with Laser Cannon MK XX using standard mode.
The attack missed the target completely!
PMI Scout #1 attacks with Strategic Nuke MK V => Incoming Nuke!
Radiological detonation on target, doing 247500 damage!
Target shield is down!
OVERLOAD IMMINENT!
Sargas Oil #73 exploded in a ball of fire!

PMI Scout #1 is inspecting the station wreckage...
255 m3 Iron, 38 m3 Lead, 78 m3 Moissanite, 1085 m3 Mercury, 234 m3 Nickel, 34 m3 Danbaite, 961 m3 Silicon, 1246 m3 Silver, 47 m3 Chengdeite, 34 m3 Platinum, 1597 m3 Iron-nickel, 301 m3 Aluminum, 3 m3 Gold, 531 m3 Taenite, 151 m3 Cabriite, 82 m3 Oxygen, 203 m3 Bromine, 151 m3 Xenon, 5 m3 Radon, 1072 m3 Nitrogen scooped into cargo bay.
Target cargo bay was empty.

PMI Scout #1 Vs. sargas planetary force
Weapons assault
PMI Scout #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Scout #1 attacks with Laser Cannon MK X using standard mode.
Hit on target, doing 25838 damage!
sargas planetary force has been defeated!
Adv Mining facility Mk XII was captured by the attacker.
Adv Mining facility Mk XV was destroyed.
186 m3 Cobalt, 102 m3 Platinum, 265 m3 Methane was found in the wreckage.
Adv Atmospheric harvester Mk XII was captured by the attacker.

Objective: Destroy 10% or more of the enemy while losing less % then the enemy.
 
Attacker victory!

Here is a power indicator from before the theft when I hit raph

18,672,533


Here is it as the time of that attack. This is after taking off the weapons for upgrades but the downgrade in power is only down about a mill.


1,879,580


That is a huge loss of power.   Here is a report from when I hit raph to show just some of the weapon modules that was used.


Jupiter
 
Attacker opened fire!

PMI Command #1 Vs. SSS Factory 6
Weapons assault
PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Direct hit on target, doing 114700 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Minor hit on target, doing 42550 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Hit on target, doing 109150 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Critical hit on target, doing 190550 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Critical hit on target, doing 186850 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Direct hit on target, doing 112850 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Direct hit on target, doing 122100 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Light hit on target, doing 74000 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Hit on target, doing 105450 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Hit on target, doing 111000 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Direct hit on target, doing 127650 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Minor hit on target, doing 46250 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Light hit on target, doing 90650 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK CXCVII using standard formation.
Critical hit on target, doing 207200 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Railgun Battery MK XX using standard mode.
Direct hit on target, doing 85526 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Railgun Battery MK XX using standard mode.
Excellent hit on target, doing 103397 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Railgun Battery MK XX using standard mode.
Direct hit on target, doing 93185 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Laser Cannon MK XXXVII using standard mode.
Hit on target, doing 56610 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK XL using standard formation.
Direct hit on target, doing 25854 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK XL using standard formation.
Minor hit on target, doing 11137 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK XL using standard formation.
Hit on target, doing 23070 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK XL using standard formation.
The attack missed the target completely!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK XL using standard formation.
Direct hit on target, doing 29831 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK XL using standard formation.
Minor hit on target, doing 12728 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK XL using standard formation.
Light hit on target, doing 16706 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into fire range and attacks first.
PMI Command #1 attacks with Viper Squadron MK XL using standard formation.
Hit on target, doing 22672 damage!

Boarding assault
PMI Command #1 maneuvers into boarding range first.
PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK M to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 1308163 damage!
SSS Factory 6 sending Marines Assault Unit MK CL to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 159216 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into boarding range first.
PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK M to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 1168997 damage!
SSS Factory 6 sending Marines Assault Unit MK CL to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 208042 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into boarding range first.
PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK M to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 1280330 damage!
SSS Factory 6 sending Marines Assault Unit MK CL to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 214411 damage!

PMI Command #1 maneuvers into boarding range first.
PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK M to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 1322080 damage!
Target shield is down!
EMERGENCY JUMP!
SSS Factory 6 has retreated from the battlefield due to heavy damage!
PMI Command #1 captured a group of 10573 enemy personnel during the fight.

PMI Command #1 Vs. Kindergarten School
Boarding assault
PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK M to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 1252497 damage!
Kindergarten School surrendered and is looted!
Target cargo bay was empty.

PMI Command #1 Vs. Home for the Aged
Boarding assault
PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK M to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 1266413 damage!
Home for the Aged surrendered and is looted!
Target cargo bay was empty.

PMI Command #1 Vs. Maternity Ward
Boarding assault
PMI Command #1 maneuvers into boarding range first.
PMI Command #1 sending Marines Assault Unit MK M to find a boarding spot.
The boarding party found an area and sabotaged it, doing 1210747 damage!
Maternity Ward surrendered and is looted!
Target cargo bay was empty.

Objective: Destroy 10% or more of the enemy while losing less % then the enemy.
 
Attacker victory!

this issue needs to be responded to by the other council members.  we all know what your jingoistic response will be, don't we?

all I ever wanted was something more specific that 'some'.  I need numbers and levels, give me something to work with here.

I told you I didn't keep a record of that.  I didn't think I needed to cause I trusted you both.  Now I know I need to.  Mata should know which ones he took though and all I really want is the shields back. Though if he would rather give up some of the weapons or marines I would be satified with that instead.   Your responses have been pretty much the same thing.  Show me a list.  Or, now this one here is really what made me rage,  "My legal team has advised me to speak no more regarding this topic due to impending litigation."

Then there are the ones saying what he did in the past doesn't matter.  Which says to me "I don't give a crap if he took mods from you"

Do you see how these can be frusterated? These aren't the kind of responsed I would expect from a friend.  A friend would offer to see what he can do and try to talk to the other guy. Not spout off the same crap excuses over and over again.   Do you know how all this looks to me?  It looks like one big act of betrayal.  Betrayal from Mata for just swiping them without discussing anything from me.  Then betrayal by you for seeming to just be trying to blow me off with excuses and stuff. It makes it look like you don't care.   Betrayal by people I thought were my friends is just something that aggrivates me a lot.  Just like corperate theft does. Put them together and it makes me really mad.

It is your actions, JJ, that are on trial here, not mine.

I am aware of that.  But I am also letting my motives for those actions be known.

OK first up, as senior member of the GC here, i call for AN IMMEDIATE CEASE FIRE in the sol system by GC members, while this is reviewed. Naturally I cant dictate to EoS about a cease fire should they choose to take the action further, but if they choose to take that course, then I cannot prevent any GC member from defending itself and further igniting the situation.

I would call upon active members of the GC council to comment on the current affair, please, to get a general ruling or consensus toward one of our own members actions.

Naturally, we already have PMI response to their reasoning and will not be needed for further comment on the matter, until such time as questions are asked of by the remaining ruling council representatives if needed.

We will review this shortly with our fellow members. I call for ITO and NHC (if they are listening or bothered to listen) to make their opinions on this issue.

In my opinion the probelm should be solved professional. That means to me: Sargas and JamJulLison should negotiate the estimated value of the modules.
The Eos should transfer

1. back the modules(or some of them, belongs on negotiation)

OR

2. pay the value in QP to them

BUT to me the primary problem is between mata and PMI. Sargas, you fulfill your function as the leader of EoS, but if Mata is interested in being honest he should do the steps I explained above.

EoS agrees to the cease fire and wishes this situation be resolved in a lawful, civilized manner.

I await any questions from the GC investigators.

May we take everything said in this forum as evidence?

I will agree to a temporary ceasefire.  However if some of the corp property is not returned by next Friday my attacks will resume.  As for if they will occur in Sol again.  I haven't decided.  I would hope to avoid doing that again.  It gave you a good chance to see how much weaker the former big corp ship is now. Which was my primary purpose in using it to assault your jupiter station. 

Captain Dadds, It looks like an admission of guilt to me.  And please advise the defendent to not give out ultimatums in this proceeding.



(edit to make the color more easily read.)

I never once denied what I did.  But theft was committed.  Talking to mata wasn't proving productive. I quickly saw he wasn't going to do anything. You weren't seeming to do much of anything.  I got the feeling you don't care much.  If you were a real friend you would have done what you could have to helped rather then give me the responses you did.  If the situations had been reversed you know very well I would do whatever I could to make sure either I got you your stuff back or was able to give you restitution at the very least.  Talking has proven useless.  So other actions are called for.  Any of your stuff may be safe from further attacks, however I can't guarentee the rest of your stuff or stuff belonging to other corp members will be.  But I am willing to give that temperary ceasefire.  Sargas if I had seen some really convincing responses back that showed you were actually trying and not trying to brush me off to the side, I wouldn't hold you or your corp responsible. Just mata. But by doing what you did it seems clear the corp has no issues harboring thieves.  There for to me the corp becomes just as valid of a target.  I wonder, what would happen if say Raph decided he wanted to join your corp? By your policy of "a fresh start and past stuff not held against them"  does that mean you would be protecting raph as well?  With that kind of policy anyone with a checkered past can join and be protected.  Do you see all the kinds of problems that can lead to?

I understand you frustration, but this topic is about your breaking GC law and nothing else.

Once this is settled, I would welcome a neutral party to mediate your other concern.

The two issues have a lot to do with each other though.   To me this is a domestic matter.  Remember when Dadds wanted to outlaw Raph.  If we had said no we were still going to let him go after within sol system despite the GC charter.  We had considered it a matter between IMG and Raph/SSS.  This is a matter between Me and EoS.  I am not even bringing the rest of PMI into this. They can go about their own buisness. Nothing was getting done when I tried talking so I had to try something else.

This topic is not about Captain Jam-Jul versus EoS, it is about Captain Jam-Jul versus GC law.

With IMG and Raph though an exception was going to be made though for him to attack Raph in Sol since we understood it was a domestic matter between just them.  This isn't much different. Though in this case it is over corperate theft.

and again, this topic is about your breaking Galactic Council law, nothing else...

As far as I am concerned, your other concern is up for mediation in the Counsil Chambers, and needs to be resolved there.

As far as I am concerned the 2 matters are connected and so they should be handled in the same issues.  I didn't attack the station to be an butthole or to just see it blow up.   My reasonings are quite clear in the matter and it wouldn't have happened if this matter had been handled better by you.  Hell no progress would have likely been made at all if I hadn't acted as I did.  I would like to bring up the case of BillNorthon and a comment made by Dadds when I had wanted to add the guy to the outlaw list.  I will quote it here.




I have bolded the important line there.  That right there says clearly to me that IMG didn't care if we attacked him within Sol.  Since this is a similar circumstance, I felt that should be brought up. Of course in this case, the theft is even larger.  How does it all look to me from my end?  It looks like you don't give a give a crap it the theft might have hurt PMI or that it happened at all?  It looks like your condoning it. As mata's leader and considering all that, that means you should be held responsible as well.  This move by me not only helped to relieve some frustruation, but lets me show you just how upset I am over this and how seriously I take it.  It also let you see first hand how much that corp ship has been weakened from the theft.  Also I had 3 or 4 COM missions I was ready to do. One of which I was currently on.  They had to be aborted becaused of the weakened state of the ship.  This results in a huge loss in profits there too. Most of the income I was bringing in with that ship I was using to help out the other corp ships.  So this hurts the corp on multiple levels. Add that in with feeling betrayed by the both of you, I was really raging and am still really upset over the matter.  Does it violate the charter?  Yes it does. But did I have a good reason?  Yes I did.  Is there past GC comments made that could possible support such an action?  Yes there is. I quoted it right up there.

and another admission of guilt.

You act like I have been trying to deny the whole thing. I have been open and honest about this whole thing. 

my losses in this matter are $4,114,314 in replacement value.

And if some of the modules are not returned that is just likely to get higher. Ceasefire is until friday as I said. Then I will begin hunting for your other stations if some are not returned. I would prefer the shield modules but since I didn't keep a record of all the mods, some of the others would work. I showed a battle report that shows some of those as proof that those were there.

OK, here at least is my thoughts after reading all the discussion between the two parties:

The attack outside of the Sol system on the EoS fuel depot is of no consequence to the GC as it doesnt contravene any one of our charters, so will be ignored as evidence of guilt here.

We have clearly got 2 issues here.
1. Has the Galactic Charter been broken with the opening fire upon another corporation as to cause destruction of property? and;
2. Was the removal of PMI property from their corp ships considered theft?

Regarding note 2:
"Each corporation leader sets his or her own internal code of conduct and values to be adhered to by its members while serving that corporation. Some of those values are written codes while some are verbal or implied. The corporation leader gives certain trusts and permissions to its members in accordance with an understanding and acceptance of these values or codes of conduct, to comply and to uphold to them"

Individual and/or Corporate codes of conduct are always internal values set upon its members to follow, or face their own internal consequences based on that corporations legal, moral and ethical rulings. It is not up to the GC to tell Corporation leaders how they should run their own internal rules and laws. At the very most all we can do in extreme circumstances is to let corporations know that we either approve or disapprove of their conduct within the social community as a whole, and where the actions are considered socially unacceptable, to have that person or persons declared outlaw status.
As such, the theft, actual or perceived by that corporation's code of conduct is not an issue the GC can make a ruling on or to issue any demands to said individuals to "make good" with returning any alleged stolen property. That is for a forum with its own thread for corporations to "put their views and thoughts toward the issue"
On that note however, We at IMG will recognise the issue at note 2 to be included into "mitigation" for actions against the charter.

Regarding note 1:

Is there a definite breach of the Galactic Charter? I draw members attention to article 3 of the Galactic Charter constitution;
In article 3 JamJul's action within the orbit of Jupiter is clearly in breach of this article.
Sargas from EoS accuses JamJul of this breach; JamJul Lison admits to this breach and as a clear cut rule, IMG does concur that it is indeed a breach of conduct and that Sargas has, in this instance, followed through with correct procedure in accordance with our own ruling in article 3 subsection 2 of the charter, being;

It is true that there is precedence in dealing with this similar kind of issue in the past in the case of BillNorthon and with Raphael from SSS. The main difference here though is that both those other cases were brought to the GC and voted upon BEFORE action was granted against the player(s) in question.
Does prior consent on a similar ruling automatically infers that permission will be granted in all cases of this nature? My answer is, "NO, each case must have due process followed through before the GC acknowledges it as a legal action"
If this case had have been brought to the GC prior to an attack, quite likely it would have received a "no challenge" vote in dealing with internal issues from IMG. In saying this, and bringing into consideration the mitigating circumstances at note 2 as discussed earlier, the GC now need to consider a ruling on this case, considering the following in summing up:
a. The breach has been acknowledged and is not under question. The accuser, the defendant and IMG concur that the article of law HAS been breached.
b. There is no further evidence presented to suggest this was a retaliatory strike against an earlier incursion against a GC member.
c. There are mitigating circumstances outlining the defendants reasonings for being found in breach of the Galactic Charter article 3.

There is no need for a guilty vote, as JamJul Lison confesses and has no challenge to the breach, but when considering the penalty I would draw the Jury toward the circumstances leading up to the event;
i) the loss of corporate equipment to a corporate leader is a stab to the heart of his corporation and can feel at the least as an act of betrayal, and at worse as an attack against the corporation power base.
ii) that the party attacked by JamJul has previously been openly called a friend, and helped assist the accusing party to break from PMI amicably to form their own corporation, EoS, adding to the feeling of "act of betrayal"
iii) attempts to negotiate internally to have the equipment in question returned failed in talks between the involved parties building frustration

Does all the mitigating circumstances justify JamJul Lison's actions? Can there be truly cases here as with "Justifiable homicide" or is it a case of, "The law is the law, equally and justly for all"?
The punishment for a breach of our own self-governed rules can range from a formal rep-remand, to expulsion from the GC, based on the severity of the breach.

In considering a suitable sanction or punishment. I draw upon JamJul's mitigation circumstance, JamJul Lison and PMI's past history within the formation of the GC, his personal restrictions to his prior activities and that of his corporation by accepting the self governance of the GC and his continued hard work and dedication in working toward maintaining the Galactic Council.

I would further like to petition the plantiff, Sargas of [EoS] to consider what he thinks is suitable punishment to suit the crime as well as to hear from the defendant, JamJul Lison, before the remaining eligible GC members casts a ruling on this matter.

That is all for now. Case will be adjourned until we receive final comments from both the plaintiff and the defendant, before resuming to cast our ruling.

Dadds, member of the [GC], CiC of [IMG], acting chairperson and "devils advocate" in these precedings

Thank you, Captain Dadds, I know it was a long and exhausting decision.

The attack ot Sargas Oil #73 was never meant to be any kind of evidence (I did not bring it up, but JJL did).  It never entered my equation because it was not forbidden under GC law.

Please allow me a rebuttal.

"i) the loss of corporate equipment to a corporate leader is a stab to the heart of his corporation and can feel at the least as an act of betrayal, and at worse as an attack against the corporation power base.
ii) that the party attacked by JamJul has previously been openly called a friend, and helped assist the accusing party to break from PMI amicably to form their own corporation, EoS, adding to the feeling of "act of betrayal"
iii) attempts to negotiate internally to have the equipment in question returned failed in talks between the involved parties building frustration"

i. this is another subject altogether, mediation is inprogress.

ii. an amicable split between friends, followed by accusations of abetting theft by a friend...'act of betrayal'...kinda, yeah...don't paint me as the bad guy here as far as frendship is concerned...

iii. no comment...


All I want out of this is:

1. an apology
2. the solars I can prove I lost (~4 million)
3. the immediate return of 881 imperial citizens.

Any punitive damages awarded will be awarded by the GC itself in a fair manner (remember, there are sanctions that need o be imposed for the crime)
I have requested mediation in the other matter.

I won't even think about giving you any of that until some of the modules are returned to me. You may want to treat this as a seperate issue but for me it is one in the same.   

Dadds I am glad you see where I am coming from and understand how these are connected.  Your right I was wrong for what I did.  But in my opinion I had a very good reason to.  I don't think Sargas understood how upset I was over this matter and how upset I still am.  I will take whatever punishment is coming to me. But I won't rest until this matter with modules is resolved. Corperate theft is bad enough when someone you don't know well does it like Bill did.  But it is worse when a friend betrays you and does it. Especially when he should know I would have been willing to work something out if he had come to me. Then it gets worse then another friend doesn't help. He said he would look into it on our forums. But after that it was the usual bullcrap responses.  BTW I would like to point out it cost me $5,250,000 Solars to destroy that station. So he wasn't the only one taking a loss there.  I felt a point had to be made to him and I made it. Though I am not quite sure if he gets the point.  I was willing to risk my GC membership and spend solars to give him a taste of how frusterated I am over this whole thing. 

Also on the subject of losses. Consider how many solars it will take to replace what was lost on the Corp ship? Think of how long and how much it will take to get the corp points back up to what was lost with what was taken.  What you lost was only a small amount compared to all that.

What I lost was exactually that, what I lost.  Because of an illegal attack by you.

What you think you lost is a subject that is open for mediation.

And I demand the return of 881 of my citizens!

This illegal attack wouldn't have been made if it wasn't for the theft from the corp or if you had at least seemed to show you were truely interested in trying to help me get some of those modules back. Instead I get the crappy bureaucratic responses from you.  A friend handles it as a friend. They work to resolve the situation. After the first time you asked me for a list of the lost modules I explained I never made a backup copy of stuff n the big corp ship. I never thought I needed to.. Then I got some bullcrap responses then again you ask me for that list despite my previous answer. You were just giving me the run around here.  You also give me the responses saying that what he did before joining your corp don't matter. Which says to me also you don't give a crap about PMI's losses from the theft. As the leader of your corp and seeming to support his actions, I hold you and your corp just as responsible as Mata is.  You told me you didn't want another BillNorthon situation when you left when I told you that you could have some stuff from the corp mining ships I was making.  I explained they were gift. Well what mata has done has not only created a situaiton very much like the BillNorthon but it has also created one similar to what happened with Razgr1z when he was in IMG in their early days. 

Fact is I could have went about this the legal way and gotten approval to hit you all I wanted.  But what would that have accomplished? You still have your powers on the forum and would have seen it coming. You would have not known how a low blow to you can feel in a game such as this.  I get this upset you. I get you took a loss.  But so did PMI when mata did what he did.  He dealt a low blow.  Your attitude about that whole thing is what lead me to hold you responsible for this whole thing.  I gave you chance after chance. Finally I said to hell with it.  I decided to send you a message. One you would get loud of clear.  I might consider paying you back for you losses here but only if I get what was taken from us.  If it is not returned by friday, the ceasefire will end and I will proceed to come after your stations no matter where you set them up. You might see this attack as a seperate issue. But I do not. This attack came about because of the theft and because of your attitude about the whole thing.  If it results in PMI being thrown out of the GC then so be it. As much as I like the GC and I want it to work, I will not stand by and allow corperate theft to go unpunished.  Nor will I ignore the acts of betrayal by people I thought were my friends.  If you really consider me a friend you will do what you can to make this situation right, then I will apoligize and repay you for your losses.  I don't want to lose you as a friend.  But I can't ignore what has been done.

It seems that JJL still doesn't understand what we are doing here.

He broke his own law.

Since it was a law he helped write, the punishment should be more severe than it would be if one of PMI's junior captains committed the offence (I remember what happened when Gronk broke one).

I, as the offended party, should not be involved in the punishment segment of this inquiry and neither should JJL.

It is up to the trial judges (Dadds and Jazzbob) to determine what happens now.

I understand completely.  You even said what you would be satified with.



So after those marines are back I will offer a public apology, give you QP to replace your loss there and a few extra to replace the citizens you lost.  I get I broke GC law but I had good reason.   I would never have gotten any results had I not done so.  If they want to punish me some other way then so be it.  I did what I felt I needed to do to get back some of of our stolen property.

OK i believe we have heard enough from both parties in question to be able to make a ruling here.
I will call upon the leader(s) of both ITO and IMG to retire in a closed Jury session and to PM myself on their findings and actions for this case.

The case is no longer a matter of guilt or innocence, as there is clearly a breach of law, to which all parties agree to. If the Jury consider otherwise they need to step forward now with the evidence to alter a verdict of guilty, otherwise:
The verdict is guilty, the punishment of the guilty party and restitution to the plantiff will be decided on by a jury of peers, taking in Sargas' losses and his demands, while considering any mitigating circumstances and arguments presented here,  to be forwarded to my office by no later than Thursday Close of business.
I direct the jury to these points in considering a sentence:
1. The galactic charter ruling article 3. has been broken by the defendent and;
    a) brings discredit upon the GC as a whole, being broken by one of the architects of the Galactic Charter.
    b) the decision here will set a precedent for any future cases of our Galactic Law which may include amendments and a review of such a charter.

2. The defendant may or may not have been in state of diminished responsibilities when he committed the breach. Did he conduct this act with sound thought and reasoning, or was it a rush of blood that he wishes he could take back, along with the QP spent on its deliverance.

Any further breaches of the GC while the Jury is in session, or any attempt to subvert or influence this Jury by either party, will result in prosecution to the greatest extent available to the Galactic Council, which could mean expulsion from the GC (in the case of a GC member involvement) and/or being labeled an outlaw by the Galactic Council
I caution all involved parties that this session is now closed for comment by the plaintiff and the defendant, while the Jury is in session.
The resultant findings and sentence will be delivered here by myself upon receiving all the juror's suggestions and recommendations by no later than Thursday Close of Business.

Thankyou all for your time here to deliver your arguments.
Court is adjourned.
_________________
edit: addendum: "of the guilty party" to make clearer that we are not going to punish the plaintiff lol

Thank you, your honor, I await your decision.

After reviewing this matter I would suggest this solution...

These are two separate matters but they are linked... One matter caused the other. That doesn't excuse the 2nd matter (attack in Sol) but it does mitigate it some.

Jam-Jul make a list of hard numbers for modules lost upon corporate separation by Mata. I know you don't know for sure, but just provide a number of modules Mk X or just a total Mk XXXXX of Module whatever to the best of your knowledge.

After the inventory is provided, Sargas $$ losses will be deducted X 3. The reason for the X 3 is that was an original part of the GC charter discussions. The penalty portion didn't make it into the charter however I think it is a fair and valid amount for breaking the law as most courts turn $200 of fines into $4000 total payment with the penalties. I feel this would be a fair and equal settlement by both parties. PMI would get the return of some modules and EoS will retain some modules to compensate for the losses.

All I am getting back is the marines as is so I a not getting them all back anyways so there is already a hit. But I am satified with just getting the marines back.  I also wouldn't have a problem sending Sargas some QP to help replace his losses after I recieve the marine mods.

The penalty needs also to be in 2 forms. recompense to the victim on loss of income/property, as well as the breaking of a law we all decided on when we formed the GC.
As i previously stated, if a petition had come in first declaring some internal issues to be resolved before opening fire, then likely it would have been allowed by majority.
While the first part of the penalty will be in a form of financial restitution, the 2nd part, the breaking of our law, must also be considered. (dont worry, the court is also aware of the time taken to review the case. if i could charge court costs, i would lol)

An extension to the delivery of findings will be applied pending final talks with the neutral members of the GC reps so we can all agree on the punishment to fit the crime. It is expected that this extension will run until the end of this week. Should no further input from NHC rep, ITO rep and IMG rep then I will conclude this matter by Sunday.

Thanks you all for your indulgences

I agree with Dadds finding,   However, Dadds can you outline your purpose punishment.

Has your leader made you the official rep now?  If you I will contact SirEmi about getting you your GC title.

for the restitution, i recommend the loss of replacement cost (previously stated at $4M+), plus $1M for loss of incomes and time in rebuilding.
For the GC imposed penalty for breaking one of its own (and written by the accused) laws; I recommend a suspended sentence of no less than 3 months to be served. In that time should Jam-Jul Lison again breach our codes and laws, to be immediately and summarily dispelled from the GC office.
Also, Jam-Jul should be ordered to make a formal public apology to the plaintiff, as well as a formal apology to the GC for bringing our organisation into disrepute, which should also include the general community for those who may consider any "loss in faith" toward what the Galactic Council is all about.
Other optional punishments could include some community service, to assist a newer player to get a help along in the game.
I draw upon several considerations when suggesting this penalty.
1. That the act was similar to "a crime of passion" as done out of frustration and;
2 The fact that the accused is a senior founding member of the Galactic Council and therefore should not be above the law, but more respecting of its rules than a new member would ordinarily be held accountable to.
3. That there appears to be some amiable moves by each party to reach terms regarding the initial loss of PMI corporate properties.
Court costs are done "PRO-BONO" this time, however should I be called upon to make another ruling against one of our own, i will consider court costs as "time lost" outside of my normal working duties lol
This is my finding in the case. Should anyone have any better ideas, more lenient, less lenient, please post them or PM them to me ASAP, or I will consider my final statement here to be an acceptance by all and to make it a decree.
That is all. I await my colleagues and jury on final agreement to its ruling

not as officially, the were talk. Jam

Dadds, I see no problem  of your purpose punishments to Jam. However, we need to address the time frame setting the payment and return loss corp items. If no deadline may cause issue to both parties.

the taken modules are scheduled to be returned sometime next week.  JJL is in agreement with it.

I will comply with the decision reached here. However I will only do so after I get those the marines back.  I hve extended the ceasefire for now since I now have an idea of when I will be able to get them.

On another note, lisunken until you are made the official rep I am afraid you are not allowed to post in threads involving GC discussion unless it is one you start yourself. Only the original power and GC reps and leaders may post.  It is a part of the charter.  I just thought I would let you know on that.

I also agreee with the arbitrament by Dadds. It is a good way to get over this and maybe [PMI] and [EoS] can get over the past and shape the future together

the mods I received have been accepted as compensation, the extra penalty has not been paid, and JJL refuses to honor it.

I included the additional pay in the cost it took to make those mods that I sent to Sargas.  Sargas wants to go by the resale value.  I am going by the build cost.

JJL, please keep your comments to yourself until after the GC responds to this.

You mean I am not allowed to defend myself?  My case is very clear.  With what I paid covered both your damages and the GC penalty I was ordered to pay.  As far as I am concerned I don't owe you a thing over then that ordered apology I am supposed to give.  Which I will give now.

I am sorry I blew up your station at Jupiter.

You do not have to answer to me, you need to discuss the GC imposed penalty with the GC.

Fine then.

Honored members of the GC.  I have paid him the additional penalty you ordered me to pay him.  I included it in the cost of the modules I built for Sargas.  So he got an amount in cost not only equal to what I owed him in damaged but also the additional solars I was ordered to pay.

OK @ Sargas. The cost you quoted in losses was $4M+. How did you come by this figure? Was that value based on what you would get on the re-sell of said modules, or is it the cost of total replacement of modules? (feel free to post module type, class and quantity to validate your claim if you feel it is needed)

@JJL: Please provide the GC with the module type, class and quantity you traded out as recompense as per GC directives.

The directive was initially issued as a recommendation, which has been accepted as a directive due to no further input from the GC peers sitting in judgement.

I await the final counts from each party before deliberating. That is all.

all I have is the report that started this inquiry:

Station MK VI    $280,000

M³   Resource   Monetary worth

292     Nickel       $4694
59       Danbaite    4838
19       Aluminum   1520
4         Gold           1560
2475   Taenite        262659
654     Cabriite       209280
7856   Mercury       644192
213     Iron            156
54       Lead           3348
689     Moissanite   1033500
72       Oxygen       3600
2303   Bromine      635628
17000 Fuel            51000
5000   Medicine     30000
450     Diamond     945000
                           4110975

This is the only record of my losses and represent only what JJL managed to pick off my bones.
There was a greater loss, but all I can prove are the material he scavanged from the station
plus 800+ captive EoS civilians.

What about your cargo modules to hold all that stuf?

Like JJL, I didn't inventory them.  All I am reporting are the proven losses.
The actual cost would be much higher, but I can not just say there was some modules, because I still don't know how many of anything is considered 'some' (is it like grapes in a bunch?).

You have the quantity in m3 that was stolen, if I add well it is: 37140 m3. Those m3 could not have no container!

cost of cargo to contain those 37140 m3: MK 1483 cost 1,874,512
cost of ADV cargo to contain those 37140 m3: MK 493 cost 4,171,766

Make you choice, did you had ADV cargo or simple cargo, do you remember?

my stations contain adv cargos, while my ships carry some high level standard cargos.  My tech level is MK LXX adv. cargo.
the only cargo carried was 17000 fuel, 5000 meds, and 450 diamonds (22,450 total).  I know those figures because I had just restocked the station.

Since the game is linear we apply the Cross-multiplication rule:

ADV cargo, 22450 m3: 4171766 / 37140 * 22450 = 2,521,706 solars

I made and gave him 6 MK 100 advance cargos.  Cost is $846,200 each.  So the total value is 5,077,200.  I might consider making him 1 more advanced cargo MK 100 but that is it.  Though considering his losses aren't even properly reported he is lucky to have gotten what he did.

they are not worth $846,200 to me.  I can only get $3,150.000 total ($525,000 each).

My point here in asking is you are all looking at it from a resell value. OK the materials should always be considered value at resell since materials are likely to have come out of ground or from wreckage and not bought. Module losses however need to be reported as cost to replace, not cost to re-sell. If you declare that you lost $4M in replacement costs, then that is the amount ordered to repay. The extra $1M being 1/4 of the total value of replacement, is for the lost time in rebuilding those modules. Not an ideal insurance model, but one which i threw out there.
Now, if you have under-declared your rebuild costs and based them on re-sell cost, then you have messed up on your insurance claim.
Both those monetary rulings was to cover YOUR losses, Sargas, and has nothing to do with the internal reprimands or imposing of sanctions by the GC to a GC member.
I wasnt expecting the cash to be paid "in kind" so it now gets fuzzy and messy, but since Jam-Jul used his time and cash to build the modules himself plus the time lost and potential incomes lost, waiting for the return of marine modules, i for one feel that he has discharged his obligations toward your loss. Naturally other members of the GC can have their say, and an appeal can be submitted to the high council ruling
An appeal against my thoughts and ruling must be lodged here by another non-involved GC council member, or by the plaintiff and defendant only, no later than 2 weeks from this posting, or i will sign off on this matter and consider the whole affair dealt with and discharged accordingly.

Dadds, GC member, CiC IMG

As the plaintiff, I require knowing what the 'internal reprimands or imposing of sanctions ' are and if they were levied.  The other issue has been concluded to my satisfaction.

thank you for your assistance.

...I learned a lot...

...topic closed...