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Author Topic: 5 April, 2020: A Day of Infamy.  (Read 997 times)
SteveCrab
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« on: April 04, 2020, 01:17:25 PM »

Today, April 5th, 2020—a date which will live in infamy—the peaceful science foundation of Omicron Theta (Orion) was suddenly and deliberately attacked by the forces of the leader of SPQNR, Consul Regnad Kcin.

Omicron Theta was at peace with that corporation and was still in conversation with its members and its Executive Council looking toward the maintenance of peace in the universe. Trade with members of that corporation was continuing. Communications with members of that corporation contained no threats or warnings.

The attack on the neutral planet of Eta Sirius has caused severe damage to Orion naval and military forces. I regret to tell you that very many Orion lives have been lost. In addition, Orion ships have been reported torpedoed in space.

SPQNR has, therefore, undertaken a surprise offensive extending throughout the galaxy. The facts of today speak for themselves. The people of Omicron Theta have already formed their opinions and well understand the implications to the very life and safety of our foundation.

As Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy, I have directed that all measures be taken for our defense. But always will our whole nation remember the character of the onslaught against us.

No matter how long it may take us to overcome this premeditated invasion, the Orion people and AI's in their righteous might will win through to absolute victory.

I believe that I interpret the will of the people when I assert that we will not only defend ourselves to the uttermost, but will make it very certain that this form of treachery shall never again endanger us.

Hostilities exist. There is no blinking at the fact that our people, our territory, and our interests are in grave danger.

With confidence in our armed forces, with the unbounding determination of our people, we will gain the inevitable triumph—so help us.

I ask that other corporations consider their position on this situation and declare that since the unprovoked and dastardly attack by SPQNR on 5 April 2020, a state of war has also existed between them and SPQNR.

Dr Noonian Soong
[ORION] Omicron Theta Foundation

https://imgur.com/a/fDnfscq
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RegnadKcin
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« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2020, 01:26:22 PM »

Guess you shouldn't have dropped those two COMs on me, huh?
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SteveCrab
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« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2020, 01:59:57 PM »

1) I have never dropped coms on you intentionally. Especially since I left SPQNR. Proof is required for such an allegation.
2) Your reaction is disproportionate. A warning message would have been sufficient and compensation would have been forthcoming.
3) I do know everywhere you have timers and I have thousands of coms stored for ring 1. Why would I drop just one randomly on you? Why not all of them just on your timers?
4) I have been playing a short time and have never sought war. You are old enough to know better.
5) You have damaged the spirit, achievements and ethos of SPQNR by ignoring your own rules and constitution.
6) I will consider an apology and an offer of compensation.

Dr Noonian Soong
[ORION]
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Gildavinor
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« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2020, 03:41:17 PM »

1) I have never dropped coms on you intentionally. Especially since I left SPQNR. Proof is required for such an allegation.
Gildavinor here ... You have dropped many coms, and were warned for them, while still a member of SPQNR. You always conveniently blamed your inadequate script writing skills.
2) Your reaction is disproportionate. A warning message would have been sufficient and compensation would have been forthcoming.
See above ... you were warned before you were ever booted from SPQNR.
3) I do know everywhere you have timers and I have thousands of coms stored for ring 1. Why would I drop just one randomly on you? Why not all of them just on your timers?
4) I have been playing a short time and have never sought war. You are old enough to know better.
You have been a warmonger since you were first admitted to SPQNR. The posts on our board to back this up are burried deep, but I remember them
5) You have damaged the spirit, achievements and ethos of SPQNR by ignoring your own rules and constitution.
It is well within the purview of the leader to make a retaliatory attack. Your dropping of the Coms was an offence against SPQNR. It is my opinion that you did it in an attempt to retaliate for being booted.
6) I will consider an apology and an offer of compensation.
As will we.

Dr Noonian Soong
[ORION]

You were kicked out of SPQNR because you couldn't play by our rules. You continually jumped claims by mining deposits already purchased by other Corp members. You argued with every edict sent down by the Consuls.
It isn't easy to get booted by us. I believe it's only happened once before, (long before my time). Now you try to pick a fight??!!
You know that wouldn't be profitable for either of us, but we are an active Corp, with a diverse membership and many allies. We will survive.
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SteveCrab
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« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2020, 05:40:33 PM »

We know where you are. You declare this war - you pay the price.
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Gildavinor
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« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2020, 06:21:13 PM »

We know where you are. You declare this war - you pay the price.
We did not declare war. Your attack on me was unprovoked. For someone who claims not to want war you have a strange way of showing it. You, sir, are a liar and a warmonger.
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RegnadKcin
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« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2020, 06:22:02 PM »


We did not declare war. Your attack on me was unprovoked. For someone who claims not to want war you have a strange way of showing it. You, sir, are a liar and a warmonger.

You forgot thief.
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raphael
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« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2020, 01:01:11 AM »

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It is illegal to attack a SEA official!
It is illegal to attack in Earth orbit!


Gildavinor
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« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2020, 07:15:13 AM »

LOL @ Raphael ... I'm glad you, at least, are getting some entertainment from the situation. At least someone is gaining something.
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sargas
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« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2020, 11:27:49 AM »

Mr. Crab,

This is not helping me decide how to process your application.

If you couldn't respect NewRome's laws, how can I be reassured that you will respect ours.

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RegnadKcin
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« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2020, 11:44:06 AM »

If you couldn't respect NewRome's laws, how can I be reassured that you will respect ours.

If you've got a spare hour or two (and who doesn't, given all the lockdowns?) ask him about "ethics".  1
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Gildavinor
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« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2020, 12:54:52 PM »

If you couldn't respect NewRome's laws, how can I be reassured that you will respect ours.

If you've got a spare hour or two (and who doesn't, given all the lockdowns?) ask him about "ethics".  1
OMG ... don't do that to yourself, Sargas. That debate is one of the very few,times I ever lost my temper with a (at that time) citizen of New Rome.
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SteveCrab
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« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2020, 04:44:51 PM »

I DECLARE ON OATH:

* I respected the laws of New Rome. I read the constitution and suggested changes to make it more democratic.

* I always paid compensation when my mistakes violated any rule. I kept my accounts in order and in the black.

* I always paid everyone for any service they provided.

* When my scripts screwed up I paid compensation.

* I stood for public office dedicated to the corp.

* I never intentionally disadvantaged my own corp members for my own benefit.

* Never stole anything from anyone.


None of the above is in dispute.


But there is an ongoing and divisive issue inside SPQNR right now that involves the use of <b>scripts</b>.

I am a scripter. I love coding. The game is well-suited to it.

NoBrain kindly got me started and provided me with sample code to get started (about 400 lines).

After 2 years, my current main script is about 18000 lines. It plays the game better than I ever could in real time.

I owe NB a lot for his help and have told him so. I respect his skill and his dedication to SPQNR.

However, there are some people in SPQNR that do not approve of scripts.

This is hypocritical as SPQNR depends entirely upon NBs scripts for its dominance.

I have written extensively on this topic on the SPQNR boards - on both the psychology of anti-scripters and the long term inevitability of more and better scripts. If I still had access to the SPQNR board I could refer you to these links, but I do not. Perhaps someone else can.

While AG is a game, it can also be seen as an analogy for the changes occuring in the real world regarding AI. We can see the same emotional responses in RL as we see in AG to the inevitable rise of computer enhanced performance.

I have chosen to embrace the changes that are coming, and to be ahead of the curve in that area.

My first degree was philosophy. My second was computers. My third was law. Then I did ethics.

So lets turn to the ethics as I can probably remember it better.

I am an atheist. I do not prejudge people that are not. Some of my best friends in AG are definitely not atheists.

However, atheism provides a cleaner platform for examining the true nature of ethics as a philosophical subject and a claimed human trait better than a deistic basis does.

In 2020, ethics is more part of science than philosphy. According to the leading peer reviewed literaure, "Free Will" is in question, and the weight of authority is that it is an illusion. Laboratory testing shows that we do not actually decide what we do when we think we have.

I explained this in a long series of posts in the SPQNR forums, with references, lab results and interpretations.

Those posts were deleted by Gildavinor. They were arbitrarily censored because they offended his concept of ethics. He did a Samuel Johnson viz a viz Bishop Berkeley - kicked a rock and exclaimed "I refute thim thus" and deleted posts that were lawfully, thoughtfully and carefully posted.

Those posts would have scrolled into nothingness soon enough.

Such behaviour will become more common in RL as persons of faith are confronted with more and more scientific evidence that free will is an illusion. The same thing happened with Darwin and "The Origin of the Species". Some parts of Gildavinor's nation still dispute evolution - examine the current references to The State of Tennessee v. John Thomas Scopes, and of course the classic Robert Edwin Lee play Inherit the Wind (1955) .

But I am not here to confront other peoples beliefs. That is a private and personal matter and is not a suitable subject over dinner. I am here to explore what will happen in RL as these AI technologies develop. This is an experiment in the sociology of AI. I am also here to compete and to win.

That means sometimes you play soft, and sometimes you play hard.

If it is no longer OK for a new player to aspire to win in AG then al new players should be told.

It should be arranged for AG to no longer accept new captains and divert all new Captains to Orion - a vastly superior environment. This instance will then close down over time.

To even compete, let alone win against such HUGE adversaries (SLB level MMMMMMMMM?) in AG requires cunning and guile. No amount of plain mining will do it. Scripts offer a slim hope, especially clever scripts that take advantage of the games quirks.

On the question of censorship, I value the opportunity to express my own views from time to time without being censored, because as JFK said, a nation must trust its citizens:

"The very word "secrecy" is repugnant in a free and open society; and we are as a people inherently and historically opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths and to secret proceedings. We decided long ago that the dangers of excessive and unwarranted concealment of pertinent facts far outweighed the dangers which are cited to justify it. Even today, there is little value in opposing the threat of a closed society by imitating its arbitrary restrictions. Even today, there is little value in insuring the survival of our nation if our traditions do not survive with it. And there is very grave danger that an announced need for increased security will be seized upon by those anxious to expand its meaning to the very limits of official censorship and concealment. That I do not intend to permit to the extent that it is in my control. And no official of my Administration, whether his rank is high or low, civilian or military, should interpret my words here tonight as an excuse to censor the news, to stifle dissent, to cover up our mistakes or to withhold from the press and the public the facts they deserve to know."

If I am denied this opportunity, the community is weaker - regardless of the proportion of people agreeing or disagreeing.

Now I have a new corp, this issue is less pressing, but I want it on record that SPQNR does not offer a free press and does censor it member's posts.


The true, unabridged story of why I was booted from SPQNR by Nick

This story has very little to do with the noble words above. Consul Kcin is acting on much baser, personal motivations.
 
My scripts are cutting his lunch - simple as that.

Nick is a perfect example of Baron Acton's famous quote " "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Great men are almost always bad men..."

He is unelected and cannot be removed.

He does not follow his own constitution.

There are rumblings in his corp.

He has not demonstrated the intellectual capacity to deal with the issues described above.

He always resorts to force.

People like Nick will become more common in RL as the world changes like it currently is.

My response to those people in RL is the same as my response to Nick - try to be nice, try to comply, try to keep him happy.

I am prepared to use my talents and knowledge to ensure the survival of AG as a going concern.

But if Nick pushes too far, is just too insulting or really loses the plot, those skills may be used in an entirely different way.

All I am asking for is an apology and compensation for an unprovoked attack on a small ship.

I am prepared to negotiate every aspect of my gameplay as it is obviously an issue.

Lets put ego aside and get on with enjoying AG - each in our own way.



Mr Sargas. I do not seek membership of your corp - I seek only a non-aggression pact, an alliance and peaceful cohabitation.. Your response deserved a considered reply, and I hope this suffices.

Soong.











 


« Last Edit: April 08, 2020, 04:57:15 PM by SteveCrab » Report to moderator   Logged

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caker18
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« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2020, 06:04:01 PM »

An Objective View on the Situation

Established facts:
1. Stevecrab, or Dr. Soong, was removed from SPQNR
2. Dr. Soong was attacked/retaliated against, by SPQNR at Eta Sirius

Facts in dispute:
Dr. Soong dropped two (2) COM missions on a SPQNR mission




My take on this:
  • SPQNR can do as they please regarding members
  • If the COM missions were dropped on SPQNR, SPQNR has the right to retaliate


I need two things right now, if possible:
  • From SPQNR: the site of the COM dropping (I won't take anything, just want to take a peek) OR a screenshot of the additional COMs
  • From ORION: a complete copy of your scripts (even otherwise; I want to take a quick peek at them 1 )
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sargas
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« Reply #14 on: April 15, 2020, 07:56:56 PM »

The Empire is peaceful. We have NAP's with all (until the other side violates that policy).

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