New look at the combat system

[raphael]

SirEmi, I have a question and I just want to know for sure: what will happen if the ships of both sides fail to defeat each other (results in a draw)? Will the stations and planetary modules of both sides still engage in battle? Will the station immediately attack the enemy's station or attack the enemy's ship first? What determines whose station acts first?

[JamJulLison]

I also like the idea that a ship should be able to fire all remaining weapons after the main attack waves:

e.g.
First wave (Weapons and boarding):
100k ship A1      vs.  50k ship D1
1k ship    A2      vs.  50k ship D2
1k ship    A3      vs.  50k ship D3

The 50k D2 should be able to fire again if it defeated the 1k A2, however on the second wave there should be no boarding and just weapons fire

Second wave (weapons flyby until all defender ships have fired all weapons):
100k A1 vs. 50k D2
100k A1 vs. 50k D3

Then if supposedly there is a station or planet involved and the Attacker is still standing, it will join the battle on the third wave.
Third wave (weapons and marines):
100k A1 vs. S1
100k A1 vs. P1

There should also be an option to set a ship as protected target, like send a mothership or important ship to fight only in the back line while on defense (third wave).

That indicates to me that stations and planetary forces would be attacked at the same time Jam.

*Edit* In hindsight I think this quote actually answers my question regarding marines in the 2nd wave... I think...

Also look at what else has been said too. It sounded like to me that stations would only engage in combat after defending ships are defeated.

SirEmi, I have a question and I just want to know for sure: what will happen if the ships of both sides fail to defeat each other (results in a draw)? Will the stations and planetary modules of both sides still engage in battle?

Good question.  My suggestion would be to let the 2 ships just keep pounding away on each other in another round of combat if there are no other ships on both sides. 

[raphael]

LOL, I didnt expect someone to reply so soon. I added a few more questions to my original post.

Anyway, hopefully SirEmi can clear all questions first before implementing an update.

[Dadds]

it was a good question Raphael. I would suggest, in a draw, that the third wave never happens. Defender blocks, and remains in place, end of argument until the attacker can muster more forces to overcome the defender. The outpost (and in particular, the colony) should NEVER fire except in extreme circumstances where it is fight or die (wave 3 scenario when there is nothing but attacking ship and defender base left). While a combat ship defender remains, they should be blissfully unaware of the arm-wrestle staged above them lol
Or, as JamJul suggests, (though now the combat gets really complex to work out) that the remaining vessels do a whole new round of attacks, last ship standing. (Note: That can be done manually anyway in a stalemate, by clicking attack again in the hopes to catch the defender off guard a little and out of breath)

[sargas]

Or, once the ships fight each other to a draw (after two rounds), the marines can attack stations/planetary forces in wave three (fatigued, of course).  This is because the defending ships (while still in orbit) are not able defend.

[JamJulLison]

Or, once the ships fight each other to a draw (after two rounds), the marines can attack stations/planetary forces in wave three (fatigued, of course).  This is because the defending ships (while still in orbit) are not able defend.

The thing is they shouldn't be able to approach them with the marines because of the stuff  blocking the way.

(Note: That can be done manually anyway in a stalemate, by clicking attack again in the hopes to catch the defender off guard a little and out of breath)

That just means another lengthy combat timer. Not something I care for.

[sargas]

The thing is they shouldn't be able to approach them with the marines because of the stuff  blocking the way.

That just means another lengthy combat timer. Not something I care for.

What stuff would be blocking the marines?  Or would the fatigued marines fight ship to ship in this scenerio of wave three?

And wouldn't the timer restart with the new ship-to-ship combat?  I feel if you fight to a draw to begin with, you will fight to a draw the next time (unless you step up power - resulting in different odds and a new timer anyway).  Between the two wave one attacks, the shields should re-energize (the only thing that would affect the power levels would be if any armor was present and was damaged).

[JamJulLison]

The thing is they shouldn't be able to approach them with the marines because of the stuff  blocking the way.

That just means another lengthy combat timer. Not something I care for.

What stuff would be blocking the marines?  Or would the fatigued marines fight ship to ship in this scenerio of wave three?

And wouldn't the timer restart with the new ship-to-ship combat?  I feel if you fight to a draw to begin with, you will fight to a draw the next time (unless you step up power - resulting in different odds and a new timer anyway).  Between the two wave one attacks, the shields should re-energize (the only thing that would affect the power levels would be if any armor was present and was damaged).

Let's see there is the ship or ships they fail to defeat.  Possible Space Stations in between the planet and the ships.  Do you see where I am going? In order for the marines to get there their ship has to be able to get there? That isn't happening if the ship can't get past the ships blocking the planet.

[Dadds]

And wouldn't the timer restart with the new ship-to-ship combat?  I feel if you fight to a draw to begin with, you will fight to a draw the next time (unless you step up power - resulting in different odds and a new timer anyway).  Between the two wave one attacks, the shields should re-energize (the only thing that would affect the power levels would be if any armor was present and was damaged).

The odds would be different. All those ships and possibly orbital stations which were em-jumped or destroyed would be initially removed from the equation, or will be marine/personnel depleted, resulting in different odds to win/lose. The other thing that can change is the attacker can realize he cant get past the opponent, so bring in more fresh troop and try again.  Naturally the defender will also be considering bolstering up the defences in much the same way. Its how to create a true stronghold of operations and seat of power etc. How strongly does the defender want to keep the location and how strongly does the attacker wish to remove that position?
I suspect in the future there may be a reason for wanting to hold onto a planet or system as the game and story develops. As it stands right now, it is a near impossibility to hold a position, unless you have more ships, and more power per ship, than the opponent has, and willing to sit them there 100% of the time to guard that position.

[SirEmi]

SirEmi, I have a question and I just want to know for sure: what will happen if the ships of both sides fail to defeat each other (results in a draw)? Will the stations and planetary modules of both sides still engage in battle? Will the station immediately attack the enemy's station or attack the enemy's ship first? What determines whose station acts first?

On wave two (weapons flyby), the attacker has to defeat / jump all the defender ships before he can attack the station / planetary force.
If the attacker does not have enough firepower to overcome the defender ships, the attack will fail due to defender ships blockade.

Even if the defender ships do not have any more weapons to fire, they will blockade the attacker and absorb weapon hits, until all defender ships have jumped or the attacker has no more weapons to fire. Only if all defender ships have jumped will the attacker be permitted to attempt an attack on a station / planet.

[sargas]

I understand now I thank you or the clarification.

[Fenix]

Yea I also don't think it would make much sense for stations to actually go on the attack, they aren't offensive weapons really or at least I don't think they were meant to be though you could fill them out with that purpose in mind. I guess that might depend on your frame of mind but I see them pretty much as defensive platforms with various non combat facilities on board.

[Matamaure001]

SirEmi, what you say make a lot of sense

[raphael]

SirEmi, I have a question and I just want to know for sure: what will happen if the ships of both sides fail to defeat each other (results in a draw)? Will the stations and planetary modules of both sides still engage in battle? Will the station immediately attack the enemy's station or attack the enemy's ship first? What determines whose station acts first?

On wave two (weapons flyby), the attacker has to defeat / jump all the defender ships before he can attack the station / planetary force.
If the attacker does not have enough firepower to overcome the defender ships, the attack will fail due to defender ships blockade.

Even if the defender ships do not have any more weapons to fire, they will blockade the attacker and absorb weapon hits, until all defender ships have jumped or the attacker has no more weapons to fire. Only if all defender ships have jumped will the attacker be permitted to attempt an attack on a station / planet.

I see. What if the attacking ship defeats the defending ship but gets defeated by the defending station, will the defending station attack the attacker's station (and planetary modules) or will the battle immediately stop?

[JamJulLison]

SirEmi, I have a question and I just want to know for sure: what will happen if the ships of both sides fail to defeat each other (results in a draw)? Will the stations and planetary modules of both sides still engage in battle? Will the station immediately attack the enemy's station or attack the enemy's ship first? What determines whose station acts first?

On wave two (weapons flyby), the attacker has to defeat / jump all the defender ships before he can attack the station / planetary force.
If the attacker does not have enough firepower to overcome the defender ships, the attack will fail due to defender ships blockade.

Even if the defender ships do not have any more weapons to fire, they will blockade the attacker and absorb weapon hits, until all defender ships have jumped or the attacker has no more weapons to fire. Only if all defender ships have jumped will the attacker be permitted to attempt an attack on a station / planet.

I see. What if the attacking ship defeats the defending ship but gets defeated by the defending station, will the defending station attack the attacker's station (and planetary modules) or will the battle immediately stop?

I would imagine the attacker's stations will continue to fight.